Help with Family Trainer 8: Totsugeki! Fuun Takeshijou & FT5: Meiro Daisakusen

[nerdynebraskan]

So I just picked up a copy of Family Trainer 8: Totsugeki! Fuun Takeshijou for the Famicom (thanks, Manuel!), but the controls are kind of eluding me. Not terribly surprising, considering I had a hard time starting races on World Class Track Meet until I got a damn manual for the game. I seriously think I tapped every button on my controller and my Power Pad, and all I figured out in-race is that start on the controller is pause (shocker!) and select on the controller quits the race. Anyone know the controls to this game?

EDIT: I've also got a copy of Family Trainer 5: Meiro Daisakusen that I'm having trouble figuring out. As far as I can tell, buttons 2, 3, and 4 control movement, but they don't even seem to do the same move every time I push them.

[Flemishdog]

The first event you just run on the middle buttons and jump when you get to the line, then quickly run on the buttons if you get a hold. then when you fall down the slope, jump again to avoid the water, if you don't make it, run on 10&11 to run backwards and try again. Some events in Takeshi's Castle have you "duck" by pressing down 2 & 3 with your hands while keeping your feet on 6&7. in the event where you have to walk through the correct door, you basically stand on 5&6 to go into the left door, 6&7 to go into the middle, and 7&8 to go into the right one. in the maze, you  walk on 2&3 to go into the door in front of you, 7&8 to go into the one on the right,  5&6 to go into the one on the left. The event where you jump on stones use the middle row of buttons, you sort of hop and time jumps to land on them sucessfully.  When you get to the castle and drive the cart, you sort of sit on it and use your hands to steer, it's hard to explain, practice when you get there, thats all I can offer  

I hope that's cleared things up.

[nerdynebraskan]

I'll try that. Thanks!

[nerdynebraskan]

Ok, I just finally got around to trying this game again. It looks like I run in the first race with 2 and 3. The controls barely seem responsive, though. I even tried both of my Power Pads (and one of them I know to work perfectly). I just seem to awkwardly jog in place and occasionally jump. I wasn't quite sure about the timing to induce a jump. I tried it with both my feet and my hands; I wouldn't recommend "running" with the hands, as it seems that I can't press down hard enough for it to register (with this game at least...)

I did manage to hit the wall once, but I was unable to pull myself over it.

I'll have to try this again, and sooner next time.

I've also got a copy of Family Trainer 5: Meiro Daisakusen that I'm having trouble figuring out. As far as I can tell, buttons 2, 3, and 4 control movement, but they don't even seem to do the same move every time I push them.

Any tips for either game would be most appreciated.

[P]

Ok, I just finally got around to trying this game again. It looks like I run in the first race with 2 and 3. The controls barely seem responsive, though. I even tried both of my Power Pads (and one of them I know to work perfectly). I just seem to awkwardly jog in place and occasionally jump. I wasn't quite sure about the timing to induce a jump. I tried it with both my feet and my hands; I wouldn't recommend "running" with the hands, as it seems that I can't press down hard enough for it to register (with this game at least...)

I don't think the mat is pressure sensitive so you are not supposed to press the buttons down harder than in any other game. My friend bought a NIB Family Trainer but the buttons where acting like they where pressed all the time even though he didn't press any buttons. We thought maybe it had been packed down in the box for too long so we straighted out the mat and let it be on the floor for a few weeks. He said it worked better after that but then he haven't played it much more. I'm not sure this would help you in your case though. Does the mat still work with other games?

I've also got a copy of Family Trainer 5: Meiro Daisakusen that I'm having trouble figuring out. As far as I can tell, buttons 2, 3, and 4 control movement, but they don't even seem to do the same move every time I push them.

I borrowed his manual for this game and it seems to play a lot like Athletic World. You stand in the middle (6 and 7 buttons) and alternate feet to start running. Push the front buttons with your hands to duck and run on the back buttons to go backwards. Left and right columns is for moving to the left and right side "tracks" in the maze. The runner jumps when you jump (press no buttons). The main difference from Athletic World is that you can turn. When you want to turn right, put your left foot in front of your right foot and the opposite to turn left. For example if you stand in the middle (6 and 7 buttons) and want to turn right, you move your left foot from the 6 button to the 3 button. If you have the manual be sure to look at page 17 and 18 as there's a brief "How To Play" there in English (doesn't explain controlls though).

[hiroshi]

You aren't trying to use a Power Pad are you? The American/European Power Pad is not compatible with Family Trainer games programmed for Famicom. Try a game available for both territories and you'll see what I mean.

[P]

Aha that would explain the wierd behaviour. Probably the Family Trainer uses wires in the expansion port that doesn't reach the player 2 port on the NES so they had to redesign the way the Powerpad/Family Fun Fittness mat is read so that it could be used on a NES.

[hiroshi]

If you can get a Family Trainer pad, there is a way to wire it up to an NES via the expansion port. I've looked into patching the games for the Power Pad, but haven't made much progress. AFAIK, there isn't a good emulator with debugging that supports both devices.

There's some documentation on the Power Pad: http://nesdev.com/powerpad.txt
and on the Family Trainer: http://nesdev.com/famitra.txt

Same problem exists with the 4 player code for Dodgeball, it only works with the Japanese 4 player adapter in the expansion port.

[nerdynebraskan]

I'd heard mixed things about whether FC Family Trainer games would play with a US Power Pad. I'm afraid the technical information in those links is way over my layman head. Is the controller itself different, or is it just related to the differences in how they plug into their respective consoles? Would a US Power Pad fitted with an adapter that allowed it to be plugged into the FC expansion port be compatible with Family Trainer games?

[hiroshi]

Re-wiring a Power Pad to the NES or Famicom expansion port is another possibility.

http://nocash.emubase.de/everynes.htm#controllerspinouts
http://wiki.nesdev.com/w/index.php/NES_expansion_port_pinout

[nerdynebraskan]

"Another possibility"? Does that mean I could successfully play with FC games on an AV Famicom with a US Power Pad, if I had an adapter to connect the Power Pad to the FC expansion port? That would be great news. I'd hate to have to buy a Family Trainer pad, given how much space these things take up.

[hiroshi]

Sorry, I'd have to research it a little more to say for sure. I wouldn't mind trying this myself.

I've seen an NES Zapper wired to the Famicom expansion port and a Famicom Keyboard wired to a NES expansion port. To work on a Famicom, it might be as simple as combining a standard db15 cable with an NES controller extension cable, but it might require more electronic components. It's also possible they could be completely different beasts internally.
Post Merge: June 17, 2013, 12:32:21 pm
Mods? Maybe this thread should be moved to Technical & Repair Assistance for others to chime in?

According to this page, the way the pad controller is read is very different between regions:
http://nocash.emubase.de/everynes.htm#controllersmats

Patching the software would be too complicated for me.

I've not been able to find much information to compare on the pads themselves. I'm not sure if the pinouts are the same, if the hardware is the same internally (which might explain why they are read differently). It would be nice to know which wires were used on the Family Trainer's DB15 connector, then we could at least see if they match up with the same pins the Power Pad uses. Info I find is more on how to emulate them.

Possible scenarios so far:

• Buy a Family Trainer pad to use with Famicom (obviously).


• Patch software to read NES Power Pad - More difficult that it seems. Still doesn't help people like yourself who own the original, and maybe not a flash cart.


• Re-wiring Family Trainer to NES EXP port to run Family Trainer software- I'm pretty confident this will work, but it's not been verified.


• Re-wiring NES Power Pad to Famicom EXP or NES EXP port- Unknown if pad hardware is the same internally or if pinout matches.


• Re-wire Power Pad to USB (or use 2 DDR pads), emulate Famicom.

Unfortunately, it looks like getting a Family Trainer pad would be the best solution for playing those games.

[nerdynebraskan]

Nuts. If it's not going to be practical to adapt a US Power Pad for the job of playing Family Trainer games, I'm more likely to give up on the FT exclusives. That would be too bad, as a couple of them actually seem interesting. (Especially Meiro Daisakusen.)