Fake or Rare Zelda or What?

[Flying_Phoenix]

The main point of my messy post was that Nintendo has never released localised games (officially imported games from other regions obviously don't count) in a region where the hardware for such game has not been released in a localised way (translated packaging, specific hardware...). It made complete sense for Nintendo to release a localised FC in Hong Kong, because it was modified to output PAL at 60 and 50 Hz. Note that they released the FDS too, but the hardware was the same as the Japanese version, because it didn't need any tweaking to work with the localised FC. They didn't "have" to release localised games, as the market was already flooded with Japanese officials and pirates of them.

(As for why HK got both NES and FC, it's a different topic, mostly related to crappy marketing strategy, I would go as far as to say that the NES was released first, and upon realising the idiotic choice that was, they tried to fix their mistake by releasing the FC. They should have released an "Asian version" FC too. )

The pattern has been the same for over 20 years, be it Taiwan, Korea, Hong Kong or "Asia" as they used to call Singapore, Malaysia, Indonesia and a few other countries:
- If they release a localised system, they may release localised games
- If they don't release a localised system, you won't find a single localised game

This makes sense to them and to me, and the logic continues even in the 21st century, with the DS and Wii. You won't find localised games without a localised console. Yes, it's not the proof you are looking for, but since I can't prove it's a fake and you can't prove it's official, it's definitely a good point.

So, when you are done with the pattern of Nintendo in Asia, you can have a quick look at this Frankestein Zelda II game and come to your own conclusions. You know that the instruction manual doesn't even fit inside the box, right? There are so many things wrong with this wanna-be Korean version I'll make a list if you want me to. But you know better than me it's not necessary.

I haven't seen the board and I have that itchy feeling it will be a Japanese board, 100% official and everything, because what they probably did is sacrifice a real Japanese Zelda II for each cart. Best option, given that Zelda II is not a rare cart in Japan. If not, well I can give you my opinion when I see the board.

In the meantime, if you want to see real localised versions with great quality boxes, manuals and cart labels that are completely in line with what Nintendo has released everywhere in the world throughout the years (even Brazil, where stuff was manufactured locally by a different company), you have plenty of options! I'm sure you have some of these nice official games, so I'm really even more confused why you still have this secret doubt (or is it hope? ) that this monster is official.

[BonBon]

Calling out masterdisk I searched for the pics of the board but the pics seem to be deleted from the thread you posted it in. Do you still have the pics. I'm personally to afraid to try cracking the cart myself with risk of breaking it.

[Flying_Phoenix]

There goes one more massive proof it's a fake, cheap cart with no screws. Please don't tell me "it's possible Nintendo made/approved plastic clamshells that would most likely break when trying to take them apart".

Reminds me of the so-called HKG Bubble Bobble cart, everybody vanished mysteriously when it was time to show the board. Not that it was hard to show an official board from the same game from any region. Still a better excuse than "I can't show pics, I don't have a gamebit".

If you still think there's a 50/50 chance it's official, I'm sorry, I can't help you! But it was nice talking to you, see you around the forum

[aitsu124]

Beautiful item though, I'd like to grab one one day, as well as a cart version of this:  http://www.romhacking.net/translations/2317/

Is that a translation of the FDS version or the Japanese cart "Zeruda no Densetsu 1"?

[Retrospectives]

But you know better than me it's not necessary.

I haven't seen the board and I have that itchy feeling it will be a Japanese board, 100% official and everything, because what they probably did is sacrifice a real Japanese Zelda II for each cart. Best option, given that Zelda II is not a rare cart in Japan."

You are not angry or anything but well, you put the bar where you put the bar but I am not that kind of a person who likes to argue over subjective opinions for the reason of just making fun over other peoples arguments or what type of persons they are. Sure, if you can tell me where I can find an official Zelda II cartridge from Japan then I would be glad to hear about it (it wasn't released and the Korean version uses the US roms)...Other than that, I think we are done. I never claimed you to have less or more knowledge than anyone else here. We are all fellow gaming enthusiasts and while our subjective opinions might differ, I honestly doesn't want to take it to a level where we make fun of each others in person instead of discussing over certain questions.

Comments like "You know better than that" and other pretentious things...like you said about NintendoAge, then let those guys have that tone of speech over there. I find this Forum a mostly friendly place and I am here to discuss in a civic tone which for me personally means that I do not question the knowledge of anyone or putting labels of what people know or what they do not know. I don't know about you but regarding this topic of what you say is a "Frankenstein", I have absolutely nothing more to say.

Have a good day.

[BonBon]

There goes one more massive proof it's a fake, cheap cart with no screws. Please don't tell me "it's possible Nintendo made/approved plastic clamshells that would most likely break when trying to take them apart".

Reminds me of the so-called HKG Bubble Bobble cart, everybody vanished mysteriously when it was time to show the board. Not that it was hard to show an official board from the same game from any region. Still a better excuse than "I can't show pics, I don't have a gamebit".

If you still think there's a 50/50 chance it's official, I'm sorry, I can't help you! But it was nice talking to you, see you around the forum

No famicom cart ever had screws.

[L___E___T]

 

Let's all be nice please - I didn't think I'd fanned any flames but it is just a game after all, and we are all friends here.

Beautiful item though, I'd like to grab one one day, as well as a cart version of this:  http://www.romhacking.net/translations/2317/

Is that a translation of the FDS version or the Japanese cart "Zeruda no Densetsu 1"?

I think it's a translation of the US version actually, looking at the ROM info on the page:  "Legend of Zelda, The (USA) (Rev A).nes - NOINTRO"

Jay don't forget some of the bigger carts like MMC5 (i.e. Punch Out Gold) do use screws, if at least those Nintendo bit-head screws:

   

[BonBon]

Ah you're right I forgot those big carts. But we all know the majority didn't use screws. My Zelda 2 cart in question by the size would be obvious to most would not use screws. If it was as easy as unscrewing some thing I'd have posted pics of the board 10 posts ago in this thread. @  flying phoenix here is a  reference video of how most Famicom carts are opened. https://youtu.be/LgCiAOmgeFc

[Flying_Phoenix]

Sorry guys, I crapped out on the FC carts and the non-existing Japanese FC Zelda II, it was 3am and I couldn't sleep. Thanks for putting me back on track

Why they made the box too small for the manual is more evidence it's a pirate (I was discussing this game a few years back with someone who owned it, and he told me the manual couldn't fit in the box). Wish I had asked him photos of the board.

Sorry to say what I say Retrospectives, but while caution is always to be had, and it's a good attitude and you are right not to jump to a conclusion, the only proof you gave me is that there are copyrights on the cart, and that the FC was doing well in Korea. I hope you can realise there are much better reasons to argue this is not an official item, some of which I listed yesterday. You keep on saying they are subjective opinions when they're not.
- Box too small for the manual
- Manual looks to be the real NES Korean manual of Zelda (or Zelda II)
- Zelda III art
- Generic pink cart
- No product code/number/info on the back label
- Manual is Hyundai, and they forgot to mention it on the cart/box
- Contradicts all that Nintendo has ever done in Asia and in the rest of the world
- More simply contradicts all that Nintendo has done in Korea itself with GB, NES, SFC/SNES, N64

There was no personal attack in my posts. When I say you should know better, I mean it, as you are a knowledgeable person with surely many years of collecting and playing games. And yes it's a Frankenstein if it uses pirate/homemade cart and box with an official Hyundai manual. Again, don't take it personally. I'm just looking at the photographic evidence we have here. We're still all friends

[Retrospectives]

The thing is that I have never questioned your knowledge what so ever. I even backed from my statement that it was an official product (since I got confused and it might as well be a pirate). I never said 50/50, that was fcgamer who did. Sure, you have solid arguments, but what I do not really think is appropriate is that you are adressing me as a person of what I know or what I do not know. Those were the "personal attacks" as you call them.

"You can throw me all your knowledge and company names you may think I don't know, it won't change this fact"

"But you know better than me it's not necessary."

Those quotes are adressing me as a person. Not what I have been written regarding the topic. But pure personal things that has no value to the discussion what so ever.

Why would I think that I think that you do not know about those companies? Why would you think that I know more than you? We live in a global world. We can easily track down information no matter where we live.

We are a community of fellow gamers. I wouldn't consider you as a friend if I do not know you in person. But as far as communicating in a civic tone and to discuss the topics in a friendly way, and not wether someone has lived in Taiwan, HK, Japan or even Antarctica isn't really that much of a value since there are for sure plenty of African gamers who knows more about games than my grandmother for example, even though she is Japanese (which doesn't mean anything regarding knowledge of games).

With that said. We come from all different parts of the world. We have to understand and respect each others cultural differences and I can honestly say that I am not used to discuss in a such "intense" and "harsh" manners as I know exist on serveral English speaking gaming forums like NintendoAge...that's all. The other way around as well of course.

This particular copy might be a pirate. But I have changed my mind in that it is an official Nintendo release. Not that I am saying that it wasn't officially released. But what I might think is possible is that Hyundae might have been releasing it, with or without the permission of Nintendo. Not that it matters, because if was not a licensed Nintendo product, then it is not a licensed Nintendo product. But that is why I was talking about "grey zones". Hyundae made other games as well for other systems and their roms for the official Hyundai Comboy was already compatible with the American NES, which would had been making it fairly easy for them to just take the roms of the already official product and put in on the FC. They also had the official manual for the game. They basically had everything except for a plastic cartridge and labels suited for the Famicom.

But is that making it a pirate? If we consider that theory, then well...Like I stated, "Grey Zones". I did some research around the Korean boards and what I could find was that no certain conclusion had been made regarding this game other than the fact that some people tend to believe it was made by Hyundae without the approval of Nintendo. But that's just speculations.

With your logics, then yes. It is not an official Nintendo product. That is for sure. But with all the efforts put into it, compared to many other Korean pirates that were straightly imported from Taiwan or the more "High End" ones from Korea itself, it clearly stands out as an item that really had been putting effort into.

That will be my last words regarding this topic. I just wanted to clarify because I feel that personal accusations should not belong in a forum where we are discussing games and not who knows the most or the least. Thanks for reading.

[MasterDisk]

I don't want to debate but I have owned 2 of these at some point and I can say the chips really seemed official. It really seems some leftover stock of Zelda 1 / Zelda 2 US chips landed in hyundai hands at some point and that is how it made it to the market.

[L___E___T]

 



Well, we know they had Nintendo chips in the official Korean NES releases right?  So that could relate to where the chips came from, considering it's the US version potentially.

[Flying_Phoenix]

Sorry if I sounded aggressive, it was not meant to be personal. It was part of my disbelief for hearing you'd give so much credibility to this game

Thanks for the explanation, and who knows what happened. I'll try to find more pics and info about this, I know how to find this thread now
Well, at least this gave me some time to think about Mani and the FC/NES business back in the days in Hong Kong. I'll be posting this in a more appropriate thread.

sorry for thos passing by who'll have to read through all of this

[fcgamer]

The problem with the cart is that there is evidence on both sides of the coin, supporting both camps, and beyond the meager information we have, it is all just speculation.

Maybe Nintendo cut a deal with Hyundai and Hyundai decided that Famiclones were more popular, hence putting together those releases.  Then the releases wouldn't exactly be pirated, but also not exactly official either.  Sort of like some of the Nintendo NES Test carts, which aren't exactly official yet also not exactly fake.  We just don't know.

With that said, it is extremely dangerous to jump to conclusions with broad statements like "Nintendo always did xyz here, so they must have done it that way in the other region too." 

http://i58.tinypic.com/fxxi79.jpg

Samurai (from India) is the classic example of seemingly official Nintendo releases that look, well...fake.  Samurai even put together some Nintendo multi carts of sorts, so would they be real or fake?  As I said before, gray areas.

Also, Rerospectives, I just want to publicly apologize for acting like a dick to you four or five months ago.  I was wrong to attack your sale threads back then, and thought a lot about what you had said in the PM you had sent me that day.  If you want to unblock me so we can chat again about collecting sometime, that would be great. 

[Retrospectives]

Flying_Phoenix...Apology accepted. No problems. I know things might get heated sometimes and that during the time of intense discussions, it might well, overheat. So from my side, no hard feelings whatsoever.

fcgamer, Absolutely no problems. In fact, I unblocked you yesterday already and for sure. I'd fancy a chat someday, here or in person if you ever visit Kansai. I might apologize to you as well, since I think that we both threw the gloves that day and although it's sad since I know that we do have friends in common, it's not the end of the world so for me it's just like I wrote to Flying_Phoenix. We are all humans we all makes mistakes or crossing lines sometimes. I really don't feel that I am the person who should clarify that to anyone, but I just wanted to let you know that it's totally fine by me. 

Anyways I might as well say sorry to the topic creator who just wanted to know if his game was legit or not haha. It certainly went pretty off-topic and that wasn't really the intention, so sorry for that!